http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8854143/dan-quinn-leaves-florida-gators-become-seattle-seahawks-dc
They took the Gators DC Dan Quinn from them.
They took the Gators DC Dan Quinn from them.
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Damn it Seattle
- Thread starter Leakfan12
- Start date
Check the story on the front page.
(Leakfan12, Escambia94, )
I gotta say that, though I know opinions vary here, in terms of image, and therefore in terms of its actual possible (I'd go as far as to say "likely") practical effect on this recruiting class, and our team's perceived future in GENERAL, this TERRIBLY timed move could well have a significant negative impact--UNLESS some steps are taken to counter it in some way(s). (To be discussed, along with more comment and detail, elsewhere here, on other threads...)
Alligator Army tracks all the Twitter and FB message traffic better than I can. This has no impact on recruiting, because recruits see Muschamp as the reason to come to Florida, not Quinn. The recruits also know Quinn's ties to Seattle and are happy for him.
Well, though our Coach and AD are (rightly) "taking it calmly in stride" in public, from what I understand behind-the-scenes there was shock and disappointment, now giving way to a kind of numbed-but-growing anger, at the timing and MANNER of this action on Quinn's part, after denying it and reassuring everyone (colleagues, and especially recruits, when they visited, just as he did the public of late) that he would be around for at least "a couple more seasons"--and he HAS been part of both an image of front-line, high-profile quality and stability in our program, along with "access to the pros", in the eyes of a lot of those prospective recruits. BELIEVE me, I hope that it ISN'T a big deal--or at least whatever potential damage-done is shallow and easily surmountable but, as I say, the timing sucked, it wasn't appreciated, and the concern is very real. The way this went down, in addition to giving an impression of instability, at the very least produced one of unexpected, even disorganized upheaval.
Other areas of consideration: What effect will our Head Coach's likely having to focus a little more of his personal, detailed attention on the day-to-day, moment-to-moment running of our defense have on his and the squad's overall growth and effectiveness? Would we have had someone else besides DJ Durkin in the DC role if they'd had a proper lead-time to consider and fill that position? Is DJ ready? Could he at least have benefitted with another season or two experience under someone else BEFORE being moved into that role? Though its effect (if any) does still remain to be seen, we may well have been able to bring in someone else who brought much of the same positives Quinn brought to the position (at the very least in terms of image, stability and the impression of access-to-the-pros among defensive prospects and their families), and thus avoided even the RISK of it messing with this important and potentially OUTSTANDING class, WITH that foreknowledge and resulting planning and execution...Again, I am PRAYING that this won't hurt us, but I am also noting points that are out there and of concern to people in our program.
(I'd appreciate NOT being "shot as the messenger" here at GE--I get enough of that among the public-at-large elsewhere...Believe it or not, these aren't just "paranoid bummers I invent on my own to irritate folks who wish to believe everything is wonderful"! These are real concerns among people who are paid to worry about such things...I'm just relaying as much as I can to my friends and fellow rabid-Gators here at Gator Envy.)
Other areas of consideration: What effect will our Head Coach's likely having to focus a little more of his personal, detailed attention on the day-to-day, moment-to-moment running of our defense have on his and the squad's overall growth and effectiveness? Would we have had someone else besides DJ Durkin in the DC role if they'd had a proper lead-time to consider and fill that position? Is DJ ready? Could he at least have benefitted with another season or two experience under someone else BEFORE being moved into that role? Though its effect (if any) does still remain to be seen, we may well have been able to bring in someone else who brought much of the same positives Quinn brought to the position (at the very least in terms of image, stability and the impression of access-to-the-pros among defensive prospects and their families), and thus avoided even the RISK of it messing with this important and potentially OUTSTANDING class, WITH that foreknowledge and resulting planning and execution...Again, I am PRAYING that this won't hurt us, but I am also noting points that are out there and of concern to people in our program.
(I'd appreciate NOT being "shot as the messenger" here at GE--I get enough of that among the public-at-large elsewhere...Believe it or not, these aren't just "paranoid bummers I invent on my own to irritate folks who wish to believe everything is wonderful"! These are real concerns among people who are paid to worry about such things...I'm just relaying as much as I can to my friends and fellow rabid-Gators here at Gator Envy.)
This is the time of year for coaching changes. It cannot be a surprise. Quinn is not a primary recruiter. Quinn has ties to Seattle. The recruits are happy for Quinn, oblivious to the change, or consider Muschamp the reason for going to the Florida defense.
There has been turmoil over the departure of Brissett, but none of the other players or staff. You can see it for yourself on campus or on social networking.
Look. If rumors are more important than observables, then I can stop posting facts here and we can be like the other forums that post rumors. Fine by me. There are other forums for that. If that is what it takes to get more than three users on the forum then all I can say is that there are other forums for serious, non-gossip talk.
There has been turmoil over the departure of Brissett, but none of the other players or staff. You can see it for yourself on campus or on social networking.
Look. If rumors are more important than observables, then I can stop posting facts here and we can be like the other forums that post rumors. Fine by me. There are other forums for that. If that is what it takes to get more than three users on the forum then all I can say is that there are other forums for serious, non-gossip talk.
Geez--I'm not suggesting anything LIKE that--I APPRECIATE your statistical analyses, E--...I'm just raising a very real point about perception and IMAGE, and its very real effect--NOT just as a general rule but in this specific situation at THIS TIME. Does my noting it, along with passing on the concerns about it, constitute some kind of betrayal?--Of Gator Envy, of what kind of site we have here, of the individuals here (yourself included, btw) I happen to like and enjoy very much in kicking everything Gator-related around with?--Of ANYTHING?
Is there not room for BOTH areas of discussion and concern? Image, rumor and timing are a HUGE part of recruiting, and you KNOW that--so why ignore at least the question of to what extent it may affect us here, in this case?
I refuse to be forced into defending something that I didn't just come up with on my own in the first place:
The fact of Quinn's leaving itself isn't the problem...Its TIMING this late in the game, suddenly and AFTER statements to the contrary, HAS caused some stress, frayed nerves and practical concerns inside the program, from what I have been given to understand...Because it IS just our own small site of deeply-involved and dedicated Gator fans, this is the PERFECT "safe" place to "share and air" such "quasi-news", and include it in our consideration and discussion, seems to me.
Maybe I am the only one here who was concerned for the stability and continuity of our program when we first started hearing rumors about Quinn leaving, who remembers being relieved at his recent insistence that he wasn't "going anywhere anytime soon"; Maybe I was alone here in being more-than-a-little surprised and concerned when this came up ANYWAY the last few days, and in turn therefore finds it relevant and worth sharing the "news" that there IS supposedly a certain amount of similar "concern", and worse, among those "close to the program"--but even if that's true (and I'm not so sure that it is), it seems that there ARE folks "inside" who are ALSO worried about it...It's rumor, yes, but can't we share and talk about this kind of thing at our "little blog"? Isn't that an ADVANTAGE to its NOT being part of some vast news-outlet? To suggest that it shouldn't be mentioned, that it isn't "hard" or objective enough, seems pretty arbitrary--and if you're suggesting there isn't room for both kinds of discussion, and more, is frankly a surprise to me.
Bemoaning its IMPORTANCE in the considerations and decisions of these young men is one thing, but denying the very real role rumor, image and impression play in the ultimate emotion-based decisions these more-often-than-not turn out to be is unrealistic, at best--and coming after me for introducing discussion of its specific ongoing effects in OUR recruiting efforts, and the future of our program, is at best misplaced anger...C'mon, man: Gimme a BREAK here!
Is there not room for BOTH areas of discussion and concern? Image, rumor and timing are a HUGE part of recruiting, and you KNOW that--so why ignore at least the question of to what extent it may affect us here, in this case?
I refuse to be forced into defending something that I didn't just come up with on my own in the first place:
The fact of Quinn's leaving itself isn't the problem...Its TIMING this late in the game, suddenly and AFTER statements to the contrary, HAS caused some stress, frayed nerves and practical concerns inside the program, from what I have been given to understand...Because it IS just our own small site of deeply-involved and dedicated Gator fans, this is the PERFECT "safe" place to "share and air" such "quasi-news", and include it in our consideration and discussion, seems to me.
Maybe I am the only one here who was concerned for the stability and continuity of our program when we first started hearing rumors about Quinn leaving, who remembers being relieved at his recent insistence that he wasn't "going anywhere anytime soon"; Maybe I was alone here in being more-than-a-little surprised and concerned when this came up ANYWAY the last few days, and in turn therefore finds it relevant and worth sharing the "news" that there IS supposedly a certain amount of similar "concern", and worse, among those "close to the program"--but even if that's true (and I'm not so sure that it is), it seems that there ARE folks "inside" who are ALSO worried about it...It's rumor, yes, but can't we share and talk about this kind of thing at our "little blog"? Isn't that an ADVANTAGE to its NOT being part of some vast news-outlet? To suggest that it shouldn't be mentioned, that it isn't "hard" or objective enough, seems pretty arbitrary--and if you're suggesting there isn't room for both kinds of discussion, and more, is frankly a surprise to me.
Bemoaning its IMPORTANCE in the considerations and decisions of these young men is one thing, but denying the very real role rumor, image and impression play in the ultimate emotion-based decisions these more-often-than-not turn out to be is unrealistic, at best--and coming after me for introducing discussion of its specific ongoing effects in OUR recruiting efforts, and the future of our program, is at best misplaced anger...C'mon, man: Gimme a BREAK here!
NaffGutts
Gator Fan
I think we will be fine, Muschamp is a Defensive-minded Coach, he will know what needs to be done and how to fill the position.
The position has reportedly been filled by current South Carolina DL coach Brad Lawing, the coach that has been pushing Jadaveon Clowney to his limits. Just saying. While half the Gator Nation is crying about losing a coach, the other half is remaining positive and getting giddy about the possibility of stealing another SEC coach.
Have some faith in Will Muschamp. He is a young coach, so he cannot copy Nick Saban's blueprint of growing up with a cadre of trusted assistants that will never leave his side. Coach Muschamp's gift to the Gator Nation is is youth and his fire. He is also crafty. In only two months he will have snagged two very good SEC coaches who may have underperformed due to lack of available talent.
Joker Philips will be a great addition to the staff. Joker was an excellent OC at Kentucky who developed some over-achievers from a limited talent pool. Think about this story: in 2011, the Kentucky Wildcats lost both start-able QBs before their season finale against Tennessee. What did Joker do? He turned his WR into a QB for just one game and they defeated the Volunteers. Likewise, Brad Lawing will be a great addition to the staff. No talent seems to land in Columbia, South Carolina, at least not until a genetic freak named Jadaveon Clowney arrived on campus. Clowney was a very raw talent, and it took a special kind of coach to actualize that talent. Imagine what Brad Lawing could do with defensive ends Jonathan Bullard and Dante Fowler.
Note that I have not created a thread on Brad Lawing's hiring to Florida, because it is not yet official. South Carolina gets one more chance at reclama by increasing his paycheck or promoting him. I expect that SC will not be able to match Florida's offer and that Lawing will make an announcement after school opens up after the MLK holiday.
Have some faith in Will Muschamp. He is a young coach, so he cannot copy Nick Saban's blueprint of growing up with a cadre of trusted assistants that will never leave his side. Coach Muschamp's gift to the Gator Nation is is youth and his fire. He is also crafty. In only two months he will have snagged two very good SEC coaches who may have underperformed due to lack of available talent.
Joker Philips will be a great addition to the staff. Joker was an excellent OC at Kentucky who developed some over-achievers from a limited talent pool. Think about this story: in 2011, the Kentucky Wildcats lost both start-able QBs before their season finale against Tennessee. What did Joker do? He turned his WR into a QB for just one game and they defeated the Volunteers. Likewise, Brad Lawing will be a great addition to the staff. No talent seems to land in Columbia, South Carolina, at least not until a genetic freak named Jadaveon Clowney arrived on campus. Clowney was a very raw talent, and it took a special kind of coach to actualize that talent. Imagine what Brad Lawing could do with defensive ends Jonathan Bullard and Dante Fowler.
Note that I have not created a thread on Brad Lawing's hiring to Florida, because it is not yet official. South Carolina gets one more chance at reclama by increasing his paycheck or promoting him. I expect that SC will not be able to match Florida's offer and that Lawing will make an announcement after school opens up after the MLK holiday.
On a related note, I need to apologize. I have been getting annoyed at other Gator forums and the overwhelming negativity that has pervaded the forums. This particular forum has usually remained either neutral or positive since I joined in 2008, at least until recently. DRU2012 called me out for being snippy, and he was right. Thanks for setting me straight, DRU.
FrozenGator
Gator Fan
There are other Gator forums?
Yep. The issue I have is that for the most part this forum lives up to its advertised description, "A mature University of Florida Gator Sports discussion forum and news portal. The ultimate source for your Gator football, basketball, and other sport needs."
The other forums are not very mature. I put a lot of work into analysis and real news. If nobody wants that, then I can take my services elsewhere. Right now this is the best forum out there and I would prefer to stay. The information gets reported here more slowly, because we do not throw out unsubstantiated rumors. It has been very dependable since I joined in 2008. Alas, if this forum wants to be like the others...
Now I'M the one who feels he should apologize--I sure wouldn't want to be the one who polluted the high standards of this site--which I agree are what set GE apart...
So in the spirit of "Mea Culpa", and not feeling Escambia94 has much to apologize for (and that's BEFORE taking into account the extensive and insightful hard-data-based analysis he does, and I for one probably take far too much for granted--especially considering what a luxury it is having him AND the results of his efforts here in the first place), I want to apologize if my wanting to share certain Gator Athletics "back-office chatter" I have lately been privy to has at times taken on a gossip-column flavor...such was not my intent--but rather simply sharing as much as I could of "what I'm hearing" with my small group of friends here "before anyone else hears about it". From now on, I'll just voice my opinions, and not bother even trying to "hint" at my reasons unless I can be factually specific in doing so. (I'm gonna CONTINUE to be a bit of a sh*t-disturber, though, voicing my own POV in sometimes a kind of "Devil's Advocate" sort-of-way--it's in my nature to do so, first of all, and anyway I feel like at least to SOME extent my "role" here.)
FrozenGator
Gator Fan
Fair enough. I was being tongue-in-cheek, just forgot my littledude.
Sorry. I have been spending too much time around negative people and have lost my sense of humor. On a positive note, I have 1,200 more days until I leave California and go somewhere happier.
Don't want to go TOO far down this road, but MY complaint about California, especially SOUTHERN California (it is a whole different DEAL up north--you should head up that way for a trip, E-, just with your wife, rather than the whole family, if possible, the first time, or at least at SOME point--both city, as in SF, which is like a little Manhattan only clean, on hills and by-the-sea, and country, mainly Marin and Humboldt counties, Mendocino, Russian River and so on, which are like a different PLANET, one stuck in a cliche-version of 1969, but in a GOOD way), as I was saying, my complaint about LA-County/the Southland especially is that shallow, Hollywood-influenced phoniness--where they PUT ON this air of cynical, know-it-all negativity that lacks even the little substance it pretends to: Scratch the surface and all that's underneath is a kind of grasping, what-can-YOU-do-for-ME, I'm-THIS-CLOSE-to-wealth,fame,and success-if-only-I-meet-the-right-person-and-get-the-right-break kind of self-delusional quest for "CELEBRITY", the One True God and only solid currency out there.
OK--There's MY rant regarding S. Cal.--and I KNOW: I spent the better part of a 20 yr.. career in "show biz" right IN "the Belly of the Beast", Hollyweird, USA. Had a rambling house-in-the-hills OVERLOOKING it all, the whole deal, I swear...
I have lots of stories, but only one, directly Gator-related, that might belong here:
After graduating from UF, I went to USC on a grad-fellowship, and my first year there the Trojans went on the road to Gainesville to play us (I believe for the first time ever)...This was in the early days of ESPN, before they got huge and played their part in making fans aware of everything on a NATIONAL scale--things were still a lot more REGIONAL. So it was that my "colleagues" there at USC, mainly arrogant, "entitled" little pr*cks, were so sure that this (the opening game of the year, if I recall) was a "gimme", a kind of "tune-up" for them (as I say, things were DIFFERENT then!)...I TOLD them, "Weeelll, we play a pretty good brand-o'-ball down in the ol' SEC...", playing the southern hick-fool (still had my accent pretty strong then, just a few months out of N. Fla.) and taking 2- and even 3-to-1 odds that "my Gators will beat 'em outright..."--Not that it wasn't a risk--I'd have been going hungry much of that term if things had turned out differently--but I needn't have worried, of course--The featured "College Game-of-the-Week" on CBS with Brent Musberger (irritatingly, as always) announcing, the final score was something like 27-to-9, Gators, if I remember correctly. Sweet was THAT victory--and one that really began to break us into the national spotlight, once and for all, btw.
OK--There's MY rant regarding S. Cal.--and I KNOW: I spent the better part of a 20 yr.. career in "show biz" right IN "the Belly of the Beast", Hollyweird, USA. Had a rambling house-in-the-hills OVERLOOKING it all, the whole deal, I swear...
I have lots of stories, but only one, directly Gator-related, that might belong here:
After graduating from UF, I went to USC on a grad-fellowship, and my first year there the Trojans went on the road to Gainesville to play us (I believe for the first time ever)...This was in the early days of ESPN, before they got huge and played their part in making fans aware of everything on a NATIONAL scale--things were still a lot more REGIONAL. So it was that my "colleagues" there at USC, mainly arrogant, "entitled" little pr*cks, were so sure that this (the opening game of the year, if I recall) was a "gimme", a kind of "tune-up" for them (as I say, things were DIFFERENT then!)...I TOLD them, "Weeelll, we play a pretty good brand-o'-ball down in the ol' SEC...", playing the southern hick-fool (still had my accent pretty strong then, just a few months out of N. Fla.) and taking 2- and even 3-to-1 odds that "my Gators will beat 'em outright..."--Not that it wasn't a risk--I'd have been going hungry much of that term if things had turned out differently--but I needn't have worried, of course--The featured "College Game-of-the-Week" on CBS with Brent Musberger (irritatingly, as always) announcing, the final score was something like 27-to-9, Gators, if I remember correctly. Sweet was THAT victory--and one that really began to break us into the national spotlight, once and for all, btw.
OK--I concede to having wandered WAY far afield of most Gator-concerns here--Even my effort to bring it BACK via a Gator-related story leaves things pretty far from "back".
So: Take it for what it was, a small personal foray that neither expects nor requires any response--though (for what it's worth) I, personally, WELCOME any such tales my friends here at GE want to share that connects with THEIR personalities and life-experiences--whenever and wherever they are inspired to do so, and I apologize if this time, from me, it may have seemed to come "out-of-the-blue"--I guess I'm engaging in exactly the kind of "train-of-thought-and-subject" discourse that in my view the best "conversation" always is--but not everyone is enamored of such self-indulgence, distraction or whatever you might want to call it, and I'll thus drop it here and now!
So: Take it for what it was, a small personal foray that neither expects nor requires any response--though (for what it's worth) I, personally, WELCOME any such tales my friends here at GE want to share that connects with THEIR personalities and life-experiences--whenever and wherever they are inspired to do so, and I apologize if this time, from me, it may have seemed to come "out-of-the-blue"--I guess I'm engaging in exactly the kind of "train-of-thought-and-subject" discourse that in my view the best "conversation" always is--but not everyone is enamored of such self-indulgence, distraction or whatever you might want to call it, and I'll thus drop it here and now!
...We WERE talking about the coaching change(s), and (I think) coming to the general conclusion that we HAVE in fact already "landed on our feet" with Lawing, the former USC(east) DL-Coach making the parallel move over to us (an interesting statement suggested itself by this move...as much general, in the idea that the same title with the Gators may be a "move UP", as specific, in the implied idea that what we already have and are likely ABOUT to have coming in lend him more-than-ONE raw-material-version of what he had with Clowney alone at USC). Overall, it would seem Lawing recognizes a big future HERE rather than at his former position with Spurrier's squad--and bear in mind: it was DEFENSE, rather than offense, that keyed that team's greatest and most-sustained success ever the last couple of seasons.
