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In defense of Urban Meyer

Urban Meyer should be remembered as a:

  • other: explain

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    5

Escambia94

Aerospace Cubicle Engineer (ACE)
Moderator
Ladies and Gentlemen of the Gator Nation. I submit the following defense in support of the defendant, Urban Frank Meyer III. Heretofore, I submit that the defendant, hereby referred to as "Urban Meyer", is charged with the following (with my statements in his defense):
- Charge 1. Urban Meyer is "a liar".
The defense pleads not guilty. The defense assert that his so-called lies fall into two categories--statements he made in desperation about his health as he was in over his head, and statements that were no misleading than any other coach's "coach speak". The defense asserts that the pressures of coaching at a major program such as Florida affected his health, and he "over-diagnosed" himself with "esophageal spasms" to the point where he could use the self-induced medical condition as a way out. Maybe his medical condition was overblown, but it was not a lie.
The defense also asserts that his other misleading statements were commensurate with typical coach speak, that certain players may have been labeled as "injured" when in fact they may have been "under the influence of marijuana". The defense accepts that covering up drug habits is wrong under the bylaws of the NCAA, but to single out Urban Meyer's transgressions apart from those of other coaches would not be proper, nor germain to the charges of his being a liar.

- Charge 2. Urban Meyer lost control of the program.
The defense pleads guilty. Most coaches seem to lose control at some point, even the venerable Joe Paterno. The loss of control manifests itself in different ways for different coaches. Charley Pell and Galen Hall lost control and handled it in such a way that only someone like Steve Spurrier could have salvaged the program. Steve Spurrier lost control to a much lesser degree, and suffered his own form of burnout that he dealt with by going to the NFL. Ron Zook lost control to a lesser degree and was fired. Looking around at the major programs, coaches that stick around for more than 6 years tend to lose control to the point that they get the school on NCAA probation. Those that lose control in under 6 years make room for a new coach. That new coach is about 50/50 in terms of success rate. The defense asks that the court take leniency on Urban Meyer in light of his health issues, his 9-month break from coaching, and his apparent return to health. The defense also requests that the court consider leniency on the basis of his two national championships and 81% win-loss record while at the University of Florida.

- Charge 3. Urban Meyer ran the program into the ground.
The defense pleads not guilty. The defense asserts that Urban Meyer did not willfully run the program into the ground and bail. I will say that he got in over his head and inadvertently caused some harm to the program that his successor will have to fix. This is a common tale for coaches. Urban Meyer is good at short stints with a program. He can bring short term success to just about any program--and he has done so at every level. I would even say he is better at that than Steve Spurrier, who was successful at Duke and Florida (obviously) compared to Meyer's success at Bowling Green, Utah, and Florida. I think this hints at an issue that affects most of the NCAA--coaches only have a limited shelf life with a program before they should move to a new job. It takes an extraordinary coach to stick at one program for a long time without losing control to the point where they inadvertently "run a program to the ground". Urban Meyer did leave the program with one of the top rated recruiting classes, a class that forms the core of the 2011 and 2012 teams. The defendant did leave the program in such a state that his successor was able to avoid a losing season, which is historic in that the program has one of the longest stints without a losing season.

- Charge 4. Urban Meyer's track record with player arrests is a sign of his lack of skill and leadership.
The defense pleads not guilty. We forget that these are kids that represent the average college student, whether or not they are scholarship athletes. They get in trouble, they do stupid things. To exacerbate the problem, Gainesville and Alachua County authorities are less forgiving of college student stupidity than, say, Miami and Hialeah County or Tuscaloosa (AL) and Tuscaloosa County. Penn State's program is lauded as one of the most successful, and cleanest programs, with the exception of the Jerry Sandusky incidents. Despite the appearance of cleanliness and leadership, evidence does show that Penn State had a high number of arrests in later years that coincided with the Sandusky incidents. The defense asks that the court consider the lack of NCAA sanctions and national attention for major transgressions when considering Urban Meyer's leadership and control of the program.

- Charge 5. Urban Meyer is a bad coach--he only succeeded because of Tim Tebow, Dan Mullen, or {insert name here}.
The defense pleads not guilty. He succeeded at Bowling Green and Utah without Tim Tebow. NFL coaches like Bill Belichik asked him for advice on the spread option offense, not Dan Mullen. Urban Meyer is a strategic coach, not a tactical coach. He needs tacticians to succeed, just as most coaches need. Urban Frank Meyer III is one of the greatest offensive minds of the modern era. ESPN listed him amongst the top offensive minds in college football. Only Nick Saban can match his success in the modern era of football with an 81% winning record and two national championships. His employer, Jeremy Foley, even kept a $1M retainer for Urban Meyer's services after the resignation, out of respect for time served. The defense submits Jeremy Foley's retainer fee as exhibit A.

- Charge 6. Urban Meyer's spread offense was a gimmick that only thrived because of Tim Tebow.
The defense pleads not guilty. Again, see his success at Bowling Green and Utah. He needed the right mix of personnel, which he did have in 2006 and 2008. He tried to adapt his spread option offense as defenses adapted to his zone read, with bad results. He may have more success at tOSU after using his ESPN analyst time to analyze Oregon, Utah, Michigan, Texas, and the like to gain ideas on integrating spread offense, zone read, and pro style better than he did in 2009 and 2010. The defense submits to the court Urban Meyer's new job at the Ohio State University and requests that final judgement be reserved until the defendant has served a few years as head coach of tOSU. The defense believes that he will be successful in his new job, and that the Gator Nation should wish nothing but the best for the former Gator coach.

In closing...
I submit to the court that the defendant, Urban Frank Meyer III, has been unduly charged on the basis of emotional backlash stemming from his questionable departure from the University of Florida. The defense would like to submit that much of the hatred and vitriol stems from misunderstanding of the circumstances surrounding the latter part of Urban Meyer's tenure. Urban Meyer resurrected the University of Florida football program, won almost 2/3 of his games, won 90% of the games against bitter rivals, gave us Tim Tebow, re-established the Florida Gator brand, and has not uttered any negative remarks about the program other than the arguable statement of a "broken program" in public, and "questionable locker room" to an Ohio State recruit. The defense submits that the defendant is worthy of our respect as a fellow Gator and deserves a spot amongst the Gator Greats. The defense requests leniency on charge #2, loss of control, and requests all other charges be dropped on the basis of this testimony.

 

Leakfan12

VIP Member
I don't like want he did I do believe he turned on the Gator Nation however hard to overlook at winning two titles for the Gators. Also you forgot that Chris Leak was the starting QB of the 2006 team. Plus college coaches switching teams has been done since the days of Walter Camp (Yale to Stanford). Even the Bear did it twice (Kentucky to Texas A&M to Bama).
 

Escambia94

Aerospace Cubicle Engineer (ACE)
Moderator
I don't like want he did I do believe he turned on the Gator Nation however hard to overlook at winning two titles for the Gators. Also you forgot that Chris Leak was the starting QB of the 2006 team. Plus college coaches switching teams has been done since the days of Walter Camp (Yale to Stanford). Even the Bear did it twice (Kentucky to Texas A&M to Bama).

Agreed. On a couple charges, I say that the defendant had the right mix of personnel not including Tebow, which included the starter in 2006, Chris Leak, and the starters Josh Harris from Bowling Green and Alex Smith from Utah. If a zone-read offense can win with Alex Smith and Chris Leak, then it blows apart the Tim Tebow argument.

Agreed. Coaches change teams all the time. When Urban Meyer does it, thousands of Gator fans face abandonment issues and whine loud enough to get national attention. Gator fans look pretty silly here in the Internet age.
 

Leakfan12

VIP Member
Agreed. Coaches change teams all the time. When Urban Meyer does it, thousands of Gator fans face abandonment issues and whine loud enough to get national attention. Gator fans look pretty silly here in the Internet age.

I doubt Gators should look silly. One, just because it happens all the time doesn't mean fans won't get over it. I sure Louisville fans are still pissed at Bobby Petrino leaving (though not as bad as Atlanta Falcons fans).
WVU fans with Rich Rod and so on.
 

DRU2012

Super Moderator
Staff member
Super Moderator
Escambia94, Leakfan12
Nope. We're just gonna have to agree to disagree. As soon as I saw the title I knew I had to basically step back, make an effort not to rant, establish WHY I feel as I do--and move on.
The more time passes, the more sh*t comes out, the greater his betrayal and bankruptcy of honor is revealed, and the clearer his true nature comes into focus.
Yes, he won two Nat'l Championshis, one more than SS; Does that make him "better" and/or "more important" than the OBC? Not to our program. Not to most Gators-at-large by FAR, I'll wager. I appreciate him raising our standards and profile even higher--but that is offset by everything else--including the mediocrity he led us to and bailed on at the end...and the way he carried that out, the fork-tongued mendacity and attempts at every kind of advantagous subterfuge in favor of his NEXT team just makes him another "talented scumbag" in my book. Indeed, it's a mark of the credit I give him for the first 5 years (and my own Gator-centric blindness to his deep flaws during that time and after) that I call it a wash at this point--albeit a "wash" that leaves a bad taste in my mouth, in all our mouths, bad and getting worse all the time.
Beyond THAT, as Forrest Gump would say, "And that's all I have to say about that."

(Now I'm gonna get my @$$ over to your "100 Greatest Gators..." thread, E-, and look back, while we're waiting to "look ahead" to all the excitement and good stuff I sense is coming our way thanks to our new Head Coach and his staff...)
 

Escambia94

Aerospace Cubicle Engineer (ACE)
Moderator
I would not argue that Urban Meyer is greater than Steve Spurrier. I am only arguing the six primary "charges" against him.

On a side note, I would bet that if message boards and the Internet were as big back in 2001, the fans would have been in a slightly less uproar about SOS leaving.
 

DRU2012

Super Moderator
Staff member
Super Moderator
Escambia94
I would not argue that Urban Meyer is greater than Steve Spurrier. I am only arguing the six primary "charges" against him.

On a side note, I would bet that if message boards and the Internet were as big back in 2001, the fans would have been in a slightly less uproar about SOS leaving.
I agree on that 2nd point, btw--I was thinking the exact same thing as I considered my overall response above--and I came to the conclusion also that there would have BEEN a certain negative reaction, especially later when he returned to the SEC, then later STILL when he started making those comments about Gator Nation's "unrealistic expectations" (might have been taken more philosophically if he hadn't returned to the SEC, etc.)...
...And I KNOW you weren't arguing "SOS over Urban Meyer" or vice versa, E-, I was only using that "compare and contrast" as the means/fulcrum upon which to balance and approach the larger arguments(s).
 

Leakfan12

VIP Member
Well Ray Graves was the most important coach the Gators had and ever will. Can you imagine Gators football without him? Gator football was nothing before he came. Also can you imagine if he coached the Gators into the 1970's and the 1980's? Well those 1984 and 1985 seasons would have counted as National Championship seasons (OK I'm guessing but I wouldn't doubt it).
 

Escambia94

Aerospace Cubicle Engineer (ACE)
Moderator
I will need to come up with a weighting system in order to rank Ray Graves. Since he has no titles or best W-L records, he will go under Galen Hall. Maybe I can cheat and put Hall in a tie with Charley Pell, then put Ray Graves right under them.

Edit: I just realized which thread I was in. This was supposed to be about defending Urban Meyer. Since he won two MNCs, coached two of the best teams, and coached some of our greatest Gators, he gets a much better ranking than any coach but Steve Spurrier. Ray Graves coached a lot of good teams and players, but a lack of titles, winning percentage, and record wins hurts his ranking, especially compared to Meyer.
 

DRU2012

Super Moderator
Staff member
Super Moderator
Well, though I was watching Gator football during the Graves era, I was still young enough not to really focus too much on who the coach was (except in extreme, flamboyant cases--like "Bear with the Herringbone Hat", "Crazy Woody Hayes" and his more solemn and balanced nemesis, Bo Schembechler at Michigan, etc.--and it seemed like Ara Parsegan's name was all OVER the place, on every announcer's tongue over the years--whether you were watching a Notre Dame game or NOT!). I cheered for players and big plays, and didn't think too much about the details of what they were doing and/or why, not until I hit my later teens and began to analyze EVERYTHING "out there" in life. The first Gator Coach I was more keenly aware of was of course the guy who was there when I actually finally enrolled at UF, Doug Dickey--and that of course was true in a negative sense: Dickey began well, building a solid team and program at first (before I got there), but somehow slipping into mediocrity and finally leaving the cupboard BARE (in the truest sense of that word's use here--I mean, when I got there, we had "Cris Collinsworth and a bunch of stiffs on offense", as the common refrain went)...the next guy was the first Gator Head Coach I knew something about even before he arrived. Charley Pell had just won a Nat'l Title (the "mythical National Championship", courtesy of "the beauty pageant" that was the 2 or 3 competing "Top 20"s then so influential: AP, UP, and eventually USA Today), and we were all excited about his eminent arrival by the summer of 1979 (little did we know--"0-11-and-1", which you say "Oh, 11-and-1..." when folks asked after our "record last season"...then a sudden surge of improvement and a berth the very next season in "The Tangerine Bowl", now "The Citrus Bowl", in Orlando...continuing the surge but gathering clouds, whispered suspicions and an undercurrent of "trouble brewing" until Charley himself was soon in hot water, fired and career plunging by the end of the next year, and in came Galen Hall--who finished Charley's good work--we were at the top of the USA Today Top-20 by mid-season his first year--and bad: We ended up on probation the following year, Galen's "foul play" continued to follow him and he couldn't escape it for that much longer...Enter SOS, our "Greatest Gator of Them All" who came riding in like the hero on a white steed to "save our program". He did more than that: he cleaned house, brought in great COLLEGE talent, made the players and fans BELIEVE again, more than they ever had before. We'd never settle for mediocrity again: from then on, we just wouldn't "settle". To me, THAT is about as "influential" AND "important" as any Coach could possibly be.
 

Leakfan12

VIP Member
I will need to come up with a weighting system in order to rank Ray Graves. Since he has no titles or best W-L records, he will go under Galen Hall. Maybe I can cheat and put Hall in a tie with Charley Pell, then put Ray Graves right under them.

Edit: I just realized which thread I was in. This was supposed to be about defending Urban Meyer. Since he won two MNCs, coached two of the best teams, and coached some of our greatest Gators, he gets a much better ranking than any coach but Steve Spurrier. Ray Graves coached a lot of good teams and players, but a lack of titles, winning percentage, and record wins hurts his ranking, especially compared to Meyer.

Really E94, you're putting two guys who cost the Gators SEC titles and possibly a national title over a guy who if he stayed on as coach, could have been one of the best coaches in college football history. OK Pell and Hall are half the reason why the Gators were punish (NCAA/SEC played favorites).
 

DRU2012

Super Moderator
Staff member
Super Moderator
Leakfan12, Escambia94
Lf, man, you have REALLY come around 180 degrees from your first responses on this subject when Meyer originally bailed, after making his arrangements (including efforts to take a chunk of our 2012 recruiting-class with him on his way to bailing for OSU), by now saying "he could have been one of the best coaches in history"?!! Um, no, he was NEVER gonna be that, never WILL be anything LIKE that, as we now know it is in his nature, an inevitable and inescapable part of his nature, to ultimately self-destruct: Within his drive to succeeed are the seeds to his downfall...In fact, I will go on record right here and say that though he may find SOME success at OSU (provided he maintains focus that long there minus his best assistants, AND doesn't get caught at the "cheating games" and team-killing special-treatment-of-favorites--short-term gain, long-term disaster--that are by now automatic to him, AND he really DOES have "something left in the tank" to propel him beyond that vacant-eyed, lost cipher with the deer-in-the-headlights-stare of bewilderment on the sidelines by late in every game his last year as coach of the Gators), the college football world has already seen Urban Meyer's "best years"...The only question left to be answered is how his "disappointing final-act" will play out--with a bang or with a whimper?
On the other hand, don't misunderstand me: I'm not nearly as unquestioningly approving of the OBC as I once was--I think there are a lot of Gators who have travelled that road-to-inner-growth and awareness in ensuing years of observation and experience to arrive at certain revisions in our opinions concerning SOS. We see more clearly now how he vainly engineered his own image--even the "affectionate nicknames" and touchstone-details (like "the visor", and so on) were all originally dreamed up and "played up" by Steve himself, over the years. Even the so-called "straight-shooting personality traits" were consciously created as part of an image he wanted projected of himself to the public at large, and they still resonate, are pushed in articles by lazy "sports journalists" as if they are objective observations and not a complex and flattering self-portrait invented by the man himself.
None of this changes the actual deeds that were accomplished, the choices he did make and actions that came as a result of those choices, and the enormous changes for the better in our gathering success throughout his time here at UF. There's no doubt he left the program "better than he found it" (in fact few if any have done more in this regard), while in contrast, few have left it worse upon leaving than Meyer--and remember, I was here for the change from Dickey to Pell. These are the kinds of things to bear in mind, as both cautionary tales and extreme examples that help to point the way toward "where they stand" when ranking ANY former Gators , players and/or coaches, on a list of "Greatest Gators"--and I for one assume that there HAVE to be some coaches on such a list (the problem is how many, and WHERE?).
 

Escambia94

Aerospace Cubicle Engineer (ACE)
Moderator
Really E94, you're putting two guys who cost the Gators SEC titles and possibly a national title over a guy who if he stayed on as coach, could have been one of the best coaches in college football history. OK Pell and Hall are half the reason why the Gators were punish (NCAA/SEC played favorites).

I am glad you pointed that out. I did more research on Ray Graves. He has a 69% W-L record (70-31-4), and is 4-1 (80%) in bowl games. I did not realize that Graves also had a season record of 9-1-1 that is comparable to both Hall's 9-1-1 records. Graves is in the College Football Hall of Fame and the University of Florida Athletic Association Hall of Fame as a Gator Great. Now I am having problems with ranking Charley Pell. Looks like he will tumble down the rankings, or get removed altogether. We had good years under him, but they could have been tainted by his NCAA infractions.
 

Leakfan12

VIP Member
DRU2012

I wasn't talking about Meyer, I was talking about Ray Graves. If Ray Graves, Bama would have been more challenged in the 1970's because If I remember from wikipedia, Bama in the 1970's spent most of that decade number one or number two and choked in half of their bowl games that decade (plus that's Punt Bama punt game). Remember Bear Bryant himself said Florida was a sleeping giant.
 

DRU2012

Super Moderator
Staff member
Super Moderator
Leakfan12
Here's where I got thrown off (in your SECOND post above on this subject) :
"...you're putting two guys who cost the Gators SEC titles and possibly a national title over a guy who if he stayed on as coach, could have been one of the best coaches in college football history"
Sorry, man, I lost track of the context in what was being talked about, & thought--well, you know how I interpreted it, and anyway you're right about Graves: he was one of our best, and certainly most notable and successful coaches until the '80s, '90s and beyond, and he COULD have been remembered as "one of the best" even after that time of upward mobility, if only his teams had been able to "break through"--but he DIDN'T win championships, and instead was emblematic of exactly what Bear was talking about when he referred to that "sleeping giant". It was SOS of course who finally "got it done".
 

DRU2012

Super Moderator
Staff member
Super Moderator
I am glad you pointed that out. I did more research on Ray Graves. He has a 69% W-L record (70-31-4), and is 4-1 (80%) in bowl games. I did not realize that Graves also had a season record of 9-1-1 that is comparable to both Hall's 9-1-1 records. Graves is in the College Football Hall of Fame and the University of Florida Athletic Association Hall of Fame as a Gator Great. Now I am having problems with ranking Charley Pell. Looks like he will tumble down the rankings, or get removed altogether. We had good years under him, but they could have been tainted by his NCAA infractions.
Well, Charley came in a "proven winner", facing a tough situation with "the cupboard bare" thanks to Dickey's (similar to Meyer's) disinterest PLUS a certain seeming vindictiveness, a petty effort not to fight for his team and reputation his last year but rather just to consciously leave us nothing, "so there!". We were all excited in welcoming Pell (we even switched to these all-orange home-uniforms, orange from neck to ankles, that whole first couple of seasons he was here--I came to HATE those uniforms, and still get a slightly sick feeling in the pit of my gut whenever we wear orange jerseys and pants), and though we had to weather that first "Worst Season in Gator History" (WSGH), our rapid jump from NO wins to 7-and-4, I believe, and that Tangerine Bowl berth the year after WSGH was cause for hope and optimism (funny how far "7 wins in the regular season" has fallen in our eyes...rightfully so, but that TOO is as a result of all of these individuals' deep commitment to making us better). Anyway, Charley did exactly what he was brought in to do, using the tools and tactics that were common in the SEC and Big Time college football across the nation then, just as his mentor Bear Bryant had taught him--only he wasn't the Bear, and he ended up disgraced and alone on the fringes of everything he loved within a handful of years, and even at one point attempted suicide in his car (it is believed, though to a great extent covered up by those who still cared about him at the time). Hall was similarly brought in after Pell to continue the steady upward trend using all HE'D learned from HIS former boss, Barry Switzer, for whom Galen had been his "right hand man" as OC at Oklahoma--but HE wasn't BARRY, not as slick, not as photogenic, and no longer under the state-wide protection they'd come to take for granted back there (much like Bear and Co. in Alabama)--and this time it meant not just punishment and firing for him, but sanctions and probation for the whole program.
Anyway, I'd say that although Hall got better apparent results (eg. those 9-1-and-1 seasons and rankings at the top of the polls mid-season for the first time--I had that USA Today Top-20 Poll, with us at the top for the first time EVER, yellowing on my fridge for YEARS--until we won it ALL for real in the '96/'97 season), he stood on Charley's shoulders (who'd had the tougher road, from nowhere, and got us close in a handful of years without actually getting US punished, only himself), and I would thus rank Charley higher and Galen sleazier--that's an entirely subjective opinion from someone who was there, but I could never imagine Galen Hall losing a moment's sleep over HIS treatment, let alone contemplating/attempting suicide in shame and failure to reach his lofty goals for the University of Florida.
 

InkedAdrenaline

VIP Member
I still have mixed feelings. He did bring us 2 titles(although who wouldnt have with the team we had). I just don't like the way he left and where he's at now
 

Leakfan12

VIP Member
Well Pell was from Clemson who wore the orange jerseys and the reason why he went with the Orange jerseys (according someone on this board) though don't know why exactly or why didn't anyone stop him. Who knows if they still wore the blue jersey in the 1980's maybe the Gators would have been cleared by the NCAA and had five titles by now (and 11 SEC titles). The Orange jerseys did work in the 1980 to 1985 on the field and 1987 when they got Emmitt Smith (but the only time it worked after 1985). F--K the NCAA. They let SMU keep their SWC titles though they got the death penalty.
 

DRU2012

Super Moderator
Staff member
Super Moderator
Leakfan12, Escambia94
Yup--all true about the orange jersies--as I say, everyone was just so excited about Charley coming over from Clemson, where he'd just won big at a place that had never had such success before--before that he was Bryant's protege at Alabama, he was the hot-property in coaching right then and "we got him"--and Dickey, knowing he was gone no matter WHAT happened after starting well then slowly s(t)inking for several seasons, had seemed to intentionally run the team into the ground his last year here ('78). The insiders must have known how bad things REALLY were, but everyone was starved for hope and good news, so all for different reasons, regents, AD and fans all were sold on Pell and ready to roll out the red carpet anyway they could--they really played up the all-orange home-uniforms-thing (even the SOCKS were orange, if I remember correctly), as if we needed and were somehow bringing in Charley's Clemson-mojo with him--that's how bad things were, and different than how it is today, thanks to all the coaches and teams that, slowly at first, then in accelerating fashion, built this program into a known powerhouse. First, though, we had Pell's first season, that 0-10-and-1 "extended passage thru' the Twilight Zone" to endure, which included a 39-to-nothing drubbing (as I remember it) at the hands of Bear Bryant's National Championship Alabama team that year (capped by a famous front page picture in the G'ville Sun of Charley's head bent down against the Bear's shoulder, face hidden as Bryant consoled his former protege, the scoreboard with the final score looming over them at Florida Field in the late-aft twilight).
Now, once Pell was fired a few seasons later, the all-orange hung on for a year or two (can't remember exactly) during Galen Hall's reign (HE had no feeling or connection to UF OR SEC history and lore, and cared only about doing "whatever necessary" to get the talent in and win with it, a la HIS mentor, Barry Switzer).
Though there may have been an appearance of blue jerseys before his actual return, it was SOS who really brought them back, especially the All Blue Home Uniforms (tops AND pants) for big games--just one small part of the "us-against-the-world" mentality he instilled in his players (and quickly adopted by the fans) that carried them and us through his first year, the one on probation (thanks to Hall's shenanigans), that ended with us having the best in-conference record (for the first time ever, believe it or not) but denied our first official SEC Championship, let alone any post-season Bowl-appearance. Nonetheless, SOS had "SEC Champion"-rings made for every player, made a point of publicly counting our first "real" Championship the Gators won the following year as the SECOND one, and continued that "counting approach" for years afterward. Just another of many examples of "reasons why we fans loved SOS" throughout his tenure as "the OBC" (I for one have difficulty applying that term to him now, though--as far as I'm concerned, he surrendered his claim to it, somewhat self-created as the Gator Coach to begin with, when he left--least of all after returning as Coach of a different SEC team).
 

Leakfan12

VIP Member
DRU2012

It was that bad? and people accuse our generation of being spoil (I was born in the mid 1980's) but Dickey was a OK coach especially in the mid 1970's. Looking at wikipedia, there's some years (1972, 1974, 1975) those teams should have been title contenders (well they lost to Bama in 1972 there). 1974: They lost to UK and Vandy (of all teams though Vandy did win 7 games that) and a point to UGA and they still played in the Sugar Bowl that year. 1975: they were six points against NC State and UGA from winning those games to face off against Oklahoma (though Penn State was Bama opponent in the Sugar Bowl that). Also found some other seasons from 1960 to 1983 where if Gators won those close games they lost, they would been champs. Also if Mike Shannhan would have stay in the 1984 season, he would have been the head coach. Don't know if that would have been a good thing. Who knows. Would he treated Kerwin Bell like QBs he had not named Elway or Cutler?
 

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